Current Stags comment

[C4IGrant]

Two points, actually.

One, Mr. Gonzales (at least in the quote) didn't imply such a dramatic difference between Colt and Stag as you did. Not that he's right and you're wrong. Not that you're right and he's wrong. Just that there appears to be a legitimate difference of opinion between two respected professionals, which is to be expected. And as with doctors, second opinions, especially from professionals, are often useful.

Two, the "You won't be disappointed" part not only supports the idea that Mr. Gonzales doesn't see such a dramatic difference between Colt and Stag (because if there were such a dramatic difference, there would be room for disappointment), it also seems that if the OP chooses a Stag over a Colt, he won't be disappointed. And that factor seems an important consideration when making any purchase.

I like Mr. Gonzales, but don't know if he knows a lot about what parts and pieces are used in various weapons. No offense intended to him, but a lot of instructors do not dive down into all technical info about barrel steel, testing, etc etc.

Pat is right. There is a big difference between Stag and Colt. Not only does Colt use better components, but they also install everything correctly.

Now is a Stag a good weapon (if you stake their gas key)? Yes. Is it a Colt? No.


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[Pat_Rogers]

You may want to ask Jeff directly rather then read into things too much.
There are differences between the two guns- Ray Charles would probably see that. (see Rob_S Chart for specifics).
The buyer has to make a choice based on his mission requirements as to the fact that there are differences.

I gave my opinion based on my observations and experience over a few decades.
You are making a "difference of opinion" out of thin air. If the OP asked if i though LMT, Stag, M&P, Oly or whatever was viable, my answer would have been different.

[Whytep38]

I like Mr. Gonzales, but don't know if he knows a lot about what parts and pieces are used in various weapons. No offense intended to him, but a lot of instructors do not dive down into all technical info about barrel steel, testing, etc etc.

But as a professional teaching weapons usage classes, wouldn't Mr. Gonzales see what works and what doesn't work? Do you really need to be a metalurgist to see what works and what doesn't work under high-stress conditions?

I thought what worked and what didn't work was what it's all about.

[C4IGrant]

But as a professional teaching weapons usage classes, wouldn't Mr. Gonzales see what works and what doesn't work? Do you really need to be a metalurgist to see what works and what doesn't work under high-stress conditions?

I thought what worked and what didn't work was what it's all about.

Am sure he sees a lot of weapons. How many Stag's he sees I don't know. Remember that Stag Arms is a small company that doesn't actually put out a lot of weapons.

No you don't need to be a metalurgist to see what works. The fact is though that the Military spec'd out barrel metal, bolt metal, testing and installation procedures for a reason. Stag does not meet these specs.

There is a simple equation we like to use. Quality parts + quality installation = Quality weapons.


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[Whytep38]

You may want to ask Jeff directly rather then read into things too much.

I read "go with something that is Mil-Spec; Colt, LMT, Stag or BCM. You won't be disappointed" to mean that if I choose any of those brands for serious usage, I won't be disappointed. I don't see any other meanings, and if the comment doesn't mean what I think it means, I don't see any meanings at all.

[Whytep38]

Am sure he sees a lot of weapons. How many Stag's he sees I don't know. Remember that Stag Arms is a small company that doesn't actually put out a lot of weapons.

I don't know Mr. Gonzales personally, nor have I ever met him, but everything I've heard about him is that he's a decent and knowledgeable person. For those reasons, I'd be surprised if he made such a comment about a rifle for serious usage if he wasn't sure of his observations. If he hadn't seen enough to comment about, I'd expect him not to comment about Stags at all.

[C4IGrant]

I read "go with something that is Mil-Spec; Colt, LMT, Stag or BCM. You won't be disappointed" to mean that if I choose any of those brands for serious usage, I won't be disappointed. I don't see any other meanings, and if the comment doesn't mean what I think it means, I don't see any meanings at all.

I hate to undermind Jeff's opinion, but about the only part of the Stag that follows the TDP is their receiver extension, F marked FSB and bolt steel (I believe).

Again, Stag is a good weapon, but you have to do a couple of things to them (right out of the box) in order to make them reliable.



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[C4IGrant]

I don't know Mr. Gonzales personally, nor have I ever met him, but everything I've heard about him is that he's a decent and knowledgeable person. For those reasons, I'd be surprised if he made such a comment about a rifle for serious usage if he wasn't sure of his observations. If he hadn't seen enough to comment about, I'd expect him not to comment about Stags at all.

I don't have an issue at all if people use Stag's for duty. I just hope they realize that they need to stake the gas key before trusting the weapon.

The comment and or question though, is Stag equal to a Colt. The answer is no.


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[Whytep38]

For the record:

I'm not dissing Pat.
I'm not saying Gonzales is the end-all, be-all guru for all things AR.
I'm not saying Stags are better than Colts.

I'm saying there's a lot of info from professionals out there, and a well-informed decision will take that info into account. Sometimes that makes a decision easier; sometimes it makes a decision more difficult. Either way, it always makes it more complete.

I have Stags in my collection, and I am not disappointed. Having said that, if I were in the market today, I'd opt for an ADS from Grant. In fact, when asked or when I see postings that ask, I have recommended an ADS from Grant. For the same money as a Stag, you get a rifle with better components. My Stag has components that far exceed my needs already, but if I can get better quality at the same price, there's no downside to getting something that FAR, far exceeds my needs.

[Whytep38]

The comment and or question though, is Stag equal to a Colt. The answer is no.

Actually, the OP's concern was this:

The only real difference between the Colt that matters to me (besides being $500 more) is that the Colt has a 1/7 twist, and the 4150 barrel steel.

Basically, two specific items: barrel twist and barrel steel. So far, no one has addressed either of those concerns. Instead, we had posts about fit and finish.