Squats – How is your head oriented?

[Wiggity]

As an amateur power lifter, I think that where you are looking isnt nearly as important as where the bar is positioned on your back and how you come down.

If the bar is correctly placed across your upper back and you "sit back" when coming down, it wont matter what your eyes are doing.

[mike boufford]

Yeah I know that I made certain statements about squats some time ago, but I added them back into my leg routine after doing leg press. One thing that I am careful about is form. Eyes forward and I'm not rushing the movement. Instead it's a deliberate downward movement concentrating on maintaining that straight back and pushing the butt outward and down.

[Silent]

Fixed point straight ahead of my eyes at the highest position, stay focused on that spot through the entire movement.

[mike boufford]

Fixed point straight ahead of my eyes at the highest position, stay focused on that spot through the entire movement.

Oour squat racks are positioned so that I can look at the treadmills. I keep my eyes on the butt of a certain lady on one of the machines and maintain focus through all reps. Works great so far.

[QuickStrike]

Wendler advises to choose a point straight ahead and focus your head/eyes there as you go down and back up.

Squats is probably the hardest compound lift to learn and teach IMO.

[bsf]

No excuses; I have not hit the weights in like 4 weeks. No doubt, need to get back on a regular routine. However, I settled on Rippetoe’s method to the best of my understanding, with lots of help from his Starting Strength book. My focus is on the ground ~6-10’ in front of me. Still lots of room for improvement. One of the biggest issues I was having is keeping the load off my elbows/arms with the low bar position, which I only started using this summer. I just do not have the shoulder girdle flexibility yet. I cannot get my thumbs on top of the bar with grip narrow enough to help keep the posterior deltoids flexed for bar support. I know when I get back to it, the flexibility will improve if I continue focusing on it.

[misanthropist]

Being a total amateur at lifting, I have no particular opinion on this. I mainly run, hike and climb, and a big squat for me would be 225, so obviously I am hardly a weightlifting guru! It has never been my focus at all.

However, I will comment that I have run across highly conflicting information on this. I have studied Starting Strength pretty carefully and assume this to be correct.

But...I also ran in to Steph St. Laurent of HybridStrong recently and had a long consult with him primarily about squats, because I'm coming back from a back injury and wanted to ensure my form was good and that I wasn't going to make anything any worse. His background is fairly extensive and he is a big believer in big compound lifts. Anyway...

His advice was exactly the opposite of Rippetoe's on head position: look up.

Personally, I'm splitting the difference, and looking ahead, and focusing my eyes upward, because I find it helps me to drive the weight up.

But man, I don't know what to think.

[mike boufford]

Looking up is a bad idea.

First of all, many people don't even know how to squat correctly. I follow the guidelines set in "Starting Strength" Look down towards the ground way in front of you. If you have the bar placed correctly, it will not come forward. Most folks have it too high, and have to use pads on the bar... more bad news.

I thought I knew how to squat until I started working out with a partners trained under Rippetoe. I had to relearn the correct form and drop my weight . Not only is it more natural, but much safer IMHO. I wish I knew this 30 years ago.

Rippetoe is like the Larry Vickers of lifting.

See the head position below...

I went to the Rippetoe site and watched the grip video. It made a huge difference in how I position and control the bar during back squats. The video was rather lengthy but worth the time.

[Gibson]

Not to engage in "ipsi dixit", just take this for what it is worth.

My way: The eyes should be cast forward on a plane that is horizontal. By this I mean parallel to the bar/floor with the neck in a position perpendicular to that plane and driven back into the bar, this might cause an ever so slight incline but did not in my case. My neck remains consistent throughout the movement: Static. It neither inclined nor declined during the movement and in my case it did neither even before beginning. I did these type squats always when training the power squat or performing the power squat.

I read people here giving advice about pushing the butt back or where the bar should ride. These are options concerning what TYPE of squat one wishes to perform as well as a certain relativity vis-a-vis anatomical considerations. "The Barbell Squat" is not some insular movement, it is performed many ways by many folks. Take this fellow:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsXY7KxegAc

This, of course, is NOT a squat per se but the movement incorporates a "clean" which in turn incorporates a variation of a front squat. You will note his head is tilted upward and his hips descend in a way to allow super depth efficiently, even for a big man. (BTW: I consider this the lift to one of the greatest feats of strength in human history, I believe he actually bumped it a half kilo later.)

Rezazedeh back squatting:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&v=zuaESO6c63M

Note head. Not inclined nor declined (possibly slightly declined under load coming out of the hole).



How about Kirk:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L0lF4...eature=related

Notice his head and hips? His head remains static, until the load seems force a partial neck move downward? Also notice the barbell, it rides in the groove. Not extremely high or extremely low. There should be a groove that can be located when the trapezium is contracted (meaning mostly scapular adduction and elevation).

How about Lee:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MdKue...eature=related

Notice the bar rides low? )Many describe taking the lowest allowable position as it increases leverage considering the spine as a lever and hip joint as a fulcrum, I suppose.) Hips move very much more back, Louie describes this movement as sitting back onto a toilet, and it far more pronounced in many powerlifters.

How about the "King":

http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&v=0AtnWZykK94

Notice his head orientation throughout, roughly static?

Dave Tate always spoke of driving the head BACK into the bar or neck, as it were, for powerlifting squat form. There is much merit for this.

In the end there are many questions too answer and many choices of 'answerers'. (Coined that word.) For me I always squatted with my feet wide, drove my hips back, kept gaze in the above. My feet were significantly wider than shoulder width my head orientation has been described ad nauseum. My bar placement was rather high and my descent was as described. BUT I did keep my back arched HARD and my spine was as close to vertical as possible as a function of ab strength. I got myself some 'BIG AIR', pulled my elbows down and back, pushed against my belt and abdominal wall and threw move chest as much as possible as the above position describes and squatted. BUT that is an answer based on my considerations. As you can see, even when prescribed to a power squat with an eye toward powerlifting, the performance has derivatives. But when the myriad of types of squats are brought forward one gets more derivations.

This post is tendentious; tedious; and worth even less than it costs. It will likely fall stillborn and maybe it should, as it had strayed.

WORDS TO THE WISE:

Many years ago an old lifter looked at me and said the following: "Son you can meander forever. But at the end there is a cold rolled steel bar that awaits, grab it and make it move", That fellow won Mr. Kentucky, set numerous regional weightlifting and powerlifting records sans drugs and fancy equipment. He was old school hardcore, my kinda lifter. Trained with him in dirt floor basement with plates that were from from blocks- ya guessed at the poundage. . .

I will not post anything else here as I do not wish to debate/apologize (read defend) my position.

Sorry for typos.. Bye.