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Thread: Carbine shouldering technique

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by 99HMC4 View Post
    Okay a few questions on proper hold of the carbine. First off not that I do but why is holding the mag well considered wrong? I find my normal comfort zone is to basically use the mag well as my hand stop, meaning I grasp the hand guard then slide back till my palm hits the lower. I don't grip the mag well. Both elbows tucked in pointing down. I know there's a lot of ways but whats the main concensus of mag well gripping?
    From a traditional bullseye marksmanship style, there's nothing wrong with gripping the magwell or using it as a handstop. You're shooting long distance from unstable positions, with no real emphasis on speed of engagement.

    From a dynamic carbine shooting perspective, it's a distinct disadvantage. you cannot control recoil as well for fast follow up shots and you can't drive the gun from target to target as fast or stop on the next target with as much precision. It's a matter of physics and the fulcrum effect that GTifosi described.

    To convince yourself, do a VTAC 2X2X2 or 1/2 & 1/2 drill using a magwell grip on the clock. Then do one using a grip that extends the off hand as far forward and as high up on the forend as possible, using it to pull the rifle into the pocket. You will find that not only are your times faster, but your hits will be more centered with the high forward grip. You simply control the muzzle of the gun better.

  2. #12
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    IMO and from what I have seen over the progression of close combat shooting, the magwell hold is a direct descendant of the old school MP5 shooting style. When the transition from MP5 to M4's as primary entry type weapons, many of the CQB instructors were classically trained from the H&K fighting school days, myself included. This caused the same combat or CQB type of instructors to translate the tucked elbow, wring the towel grip, from the MP5 directly over the to M4. Unfortunately the weapons vary and the same technique for the MP5 does not translate to be the most efficient technique with the M4's and the muzzle mass beyond the magwell.

    Of course we need to be able to vary our technique and adapt to the situation and the type of shooting that we are doing. I use a more outstretched grip as a default,which mimics my shotgun competition days, but I am also a good enough shooter to know what to use given the situation. If I want more precision and time and distance is on my side, then I might assume more of a bullseye / precision shooter type of hold, where I might blade quite a bit, get good skeletal support and more close to a magwell hold.

    This explains it and shows what my "default hold" looks like.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77p7kukuxVs

  3. #13
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    While I would tend to agree, I think it is ultimately which is the more effective grip for the shooter.

    Running tables 3 and 4 for combat marksmanship in the USMC, 99% of Marines (at least from the times I have qualified) use the magwell grip, as well as the combat instructors.

    However, from experience, there is both an advantage and disadvantage to this grip style. First off the advantage for me is that my hand is already touching the magazine, making speed reloads very speedy. The disadvantage is that if holding or pulling back too hard on the mag while firing, the mag will either cause a double feed or a stovepipe because of the angle change. I have only seen this on very used magazines that were nothing near the quality of say a PMAG.

    That being said, I use a variation of grip styles in different situations, but the mag grip has been very successful for me. Last month I qualed with only 3 rounds outside of the kill areas, two of which were meant for the t-box.

    Funk
    Last edited by Funkenstein; 08-08-11 at 07:00.
    Patrolman
    USMC 0621
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