Body Armor: When to wear, when to leave it...?

[Failure2Stop]

Big problem we had though (during my last tour) is the high ranking slick sleeve morons logging their first tour would demand ALL of the IBA suppliments be worn, which literally KILLED any mobility and freedom of movement. It got to the point where I for one would rather not wear anything at all than a full IBA with EVERYTHING on it. Just the vest, + SAPIs, + ACH for me, thanks.

Seen this problem far too many times with regular Army and Marines. The guys look like the effing Michelin Man. It's sad.

Decisions from upper eschelon pussies that never actually put on all the shit they demand their men to wear or do the things they expect their men to do with it all on. Instead of linking survivability with the ability to fight they link it to hiding behind increased armor.

My head hurts now.

Apologies for the ranting hijack.

[1SFG]

my thoughts, and of course others will differ - I am currently deployed to Iraq and will be here until probably mid 2009. AOR sees me running around BIAP, the IZ, and to several FOBS. I wear some type of armor whenever I move off my compound. If I'm out on an assault or conducting any kind of op, I have my CIRAS on. If I'm moving around BIAP I have on PT Armor concealable armor with a shirt as my covering garment But I am in the minority here at least where BIAP is concerned. Most folks at BIAP as far as I can tell have no armor on. Believe that's from an institutional belief that they are somehow in a safe zone. Considering the number of FN manned checkpoints, and as you start making your way towards Irish, a number of Iraqi controlled checkpoints, it boggles my mind that this seems to be the prevalent attitude. I've seen dudes running along roads here in tees and shorts - again, if they are comfortable then so be it, but makes no sense to me.

Everyone on my team wears their armor out on ops. Frankly I can't think of any reason why anyone in an active war zone would not wear armor out on an op. I'm usually moving in a level 7 vehicle and even then will have my armor on. The idea of trying to find my armor and don it while sitting in a disabled vehicle in the middle of an attack doesn't make much sense to me. The time spent getting it on is time that I'm not shooting back. I also don't buy the argument that an EFP or RPG makes wearing the armor moot. It's possible to survive an IED or RPG attack where the projectile doesn't somehow find you and go through you. Sure, an rpg coming through your vehicle and going straight through you won't be stopped by armor, but armor can and has stopped fragments from doing significant damage to guys and I've seen that several times.

Again, these are just my thoughts. My rig is pretty comfortable, and on my CIRAS I have what I consider to be only necessary items. For me that's m4 mags in pouches, mags for my glock, my med kit, illumination and my radio. That's about it. On some nights I might have a few other items, but the bulk of the weight is the armor and not all the crap on it. I can run and gun in that thing all day and the weight doesn't mean much. For guys who have half of California dangling off their armor, I can see why they wouldn't want to wear it all day. YMMV

[decodeddiesel]

I totally agree 1SFG, anyone out on an OP without body armor on is a damn fool. At least you have the option of wearing different armor, which as you know for us poor regular SOBs is not an option.

[strider]

If I am in uniform I have my vest on. If I am in soft clothes I MIGHT not wear it depending on the situation. Arizona can get pretty warm and I just hydrate and sweat. Better than bleedin.

[white spaniard]

Is body armor like impac trauma plates are they available for civilians?

[Redmanfms]

Is body armor like impac trauma plates are they available for civilians?

Yes. Some companies won't sell to citizens, but it is legal so long as you aren't a felon.

[JSandi]

Having been shot at while a police officer in Metro Atlanta a few years back, I am a firm believer in it!!!

I also train in it, range time and all.

The only time its not on me is when deployed in a sniper/observer position.

[sapper36]

This what we had to wear last summer. The vest is very nice without the SAPI (ceramic plates) in them but then we went to front and back around the middle to end of OIF 1 and then added the side sapi's as well. With all of that it was getting bad and its why alot of us wear a chest rig on top of it. I am a combat engineer and spend alot time doing cache and IED sweeps where we just walk and sweep for hours. With the chest rig you can dump alot of wieght and still maintain the protection. And yes I often felt like the Michilan man

[Bolt_Overide]

Anytime I could realisticly take fire, Im wearing atleast a plate carrier with plates. Usually soft armor too. Id rather be uncomfortable than dead.

[tkoglman]

I'll be interested to see how this all comes around when we are done in the desert and move on to a different arena where vehicles can't go.

I remember training in the French Alps in the mid 1990's in the USMC. We wore all the armor we had at the time, cold weather gear, NBC gear,rations, and ammo. We were dropped off by helo and the company could barely make a 1k movement in the mountains with a few inches of snow.

When I went through OCS, the commander at the time, Col. Wesley Fox, refused to have anyone wear body armor. I don't know if they do now or not. He was a CMA winner from Vietnam and believed that, at least in that war, that body armor killed more Marines then it saved.

We usually fight our last war and are caught behind the curve when something new comes up. If we happen to go somewhere next that has the climate/terrain similar to Vietnam, it will be very rough on the guys that go first and have to wear all the armor we are wearing over in Iraq.

As a cop I always were body armor on duty.