My idiot friend wants a .300 Win Mag

[Eurodriver]

He has never shot a precision rifle before, the only type of rifle shooting he has done is bump firing a cheap AK and shooting an M1A (horribly) from the bench at 100 yards.

He's trying to buy a Kimber or a Tikka souped up tactical rifle (and put a $250 scope on it).

How the hell do I convince him to start somewhere else? I've tried telling him that a .300 Win Mag is waaayyy overkill for his abilities and it will probably induce flinching at the recoil.

I have a Rem700P with a 20" barrel in .308 that he never shoots. I offer and he says "Nah, too weak. Its only a .308" but I ding steel at 800 all day. It took me almost 4 years of shooting to get to this level. What exactly he is looking to do beyond that, with no formal training or past experience, I don't know.

The one time he has shot my Remington 700 at 300 yards he couldn't get any of his shots in an 8" circle...from the bench...with sandbags, with the scope on 24x....and a Timney trigger.

What do I tell him? I can understand getting a rifle. I can understand wanting 300 Win Mag.

I cannot understand wanting a "designer brand" for your first rifle. The $500 he'd save getting a 700 or a Savage could be put to a better scope.

[matemike]

IMO Savage and Remington are nothing to shake a stick at. Build them up and trick them out even more if skill really increases. But you're right, start with good optics.

Tell him they are "designer" brands. Build their reputation in his mind.

Tell him to read here. Does he read any precision shooter stuff?

Although they are not Bentley's and Ferrari's of precision shooting, they are Mercedes and BMW's; compared to Ford Pinto's. (not to offend any Pinto owners out there)

[DemonRat]

If he is unable to take sound advise then I say this "A fool and his money is soon departed. Thankfully, I am not that fool." What else can you do besides tell his wife. lol
Let him know that a .308 is still a really great round give stats on it and let him know that there are good rifles out there that you can make into a decent tack driver using the .308


That's my wooden nickels worth

[mkmckinley]

".308 is a perfect round to learn on and build the skills you need to become a good long range shooter. You can take it out to 1000m as you build your abilities and it will force you to learn how to read wind and call it which is really the make or break part of long range shooting. You also get excellent barrel life and relatively cheap match ammo. A .300 win mag will start to lose accuracy in as little as 1000 rounds and can create/reinforce bad habits. It's also expensive to shoot expecially when you factor in barrel costs. A bad shooter with a .300 WM is still a bad shooter"

Show him Lowlight's youtube videos shooting 18" barreled .308s out to 1000m.

In the end you probably won't change his mind if he doesn't want to change it. Let him keep being an idiot, maybe he'll let you keep his brass.

[ColdDeadHands]

Actually, I think the Kimber Tactical Rifle is pretty decent. Haven't read a bad thing about them.

[Dave L.]

I would let him waste all the money in the world. Then when you out shoot him with your 700P, you can laugh at him... and maybe buy it off him cheap.

[Eurodriver]

Actually, I think the Kimber Tactical Rifle is pretty decent. Haven't read a bad thing about them.

So do I. But I wouldn't give a 16 year old a Hayabusa motorcycle because he knew how to ride a bicycle.

Maybe he'll sell it to me because its "junk"

".308 is a perfect round to learn on and build the skills you need to become a good long range shooter. You can take it out to 1000m as you build your abilities and it will force you to learn how to read wind and call it which is really the make or break part of long range shooting. You also get excellent barrel life and relatively cheap match ammo. A .300 win mag will start to lose accuracy in as little as 1000 rounds and can create/reinforce bad habits. It's also expensive to shoot expecially when you factor in barrel costs. A bad shooter with a .300 WM is still a bad shooter"

Show him Lowlight's youtube videos shooting 18" barreled .308s out to 1000m.

In the end you probably won't change his mind if he doesn't want to change it. Let him keep being an idiot, maybe he'll let you keep his brass.

"But BRO, Listen! A .300 Win Mag shoots like, twenty feet higher at 1000 yards than a .308 does. Its faster, so there is less wind movement...why people use the .308 still is beyond me"

Thats the mentality I am dealing with. He thinks with a .300WM, a walmart 3-9x scope and a bipod he is going to setup and start nailing steel at 1200 yards, even though he can't hit the paper at 300 yards with my rifle. His excuse is because its a .308 and he's "not used to it having so much drop". Not sure how that works because the scope is setup for POA/POI at 300 yards with a twist of the elevation turret.

I'm by no means an expert, but I like to think I have a tiny bit of formal marksmanship training. He refuses to listen. I will shoot him an email with links to what he should be buying and post his response here.

Have I mentioned he has absolutely no idea what MOA or mils are?

I would let him waste all the money in the world. Then when you out shoot him with your 700P, you can laugh at him... and maybe buy it off him cheap.

You have no idea, I already outshoot him in everything. Handguns, AR15s, AKs, it doesn't matter. I actually outshoot him with his own weapons. I think he is just about having the "status" of owning an HK USP, an FN Five-Seven, or now a Kimber Tactical, as opposed to actually knowing how to use it.

Perfect Example, he bought a Wilson Combat Shotgun for a stupid amount of money. Every-single-time he fires it, he fails to bring the pump back hard and fast enough inducing a failure to eject. Every single round. I've showed him how to man handle it and get proper feeding and ejection but he is content with sticking to his own habits and using his finger to work the spent shell out of the receiver.

[Eurodriver]

And win mag is pretty cheap compared to other large calibers like 338 and 50 cals

His response when I told him that .300WM is damn near $50 a box.

[Brasilnuts]

You can hit with your .308@300 yards and he can't... that's called a clue and if he can't catch it then that's his own misfortune.

At this point I say let him buy what he wants and then when the rifle doesn't perform to his expectations maybe you can get hits with it and then the light bulb will go off in his head... I doubt it though.

edit: Just read your last post. I know how it is because I have friends like this too.

[Eurodriver]

I found this rifle

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=259127008

Its the same rifle I have, only in .300WM.

He doesn't want it because its "so common".

I told him its common for a reason, and now he's looking at .338 Lapuas

It would be funny, but I know this guy. He's honest to God going to buy something that is way too much gun for him. I've seen him drop $1500 on a DSA FAL pistol like it was nothing....if only to be single again.