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Thread: 20" Barrels

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by a0cake View Post
    An ER Shaw barrel would never find its way onto one of my rifles. I'm going to leave this one ARFCOM drive by style as I have to run in a minute. I just don't want the OP to jump on this without knowing that the barrel will be a crapshoot.

    I also looked around for a second and had a hard time coming up with a standard 20'' barrel that's in stock, besides the one mentioned above. If you don't mind going stainless (heavier weight also) and spending a bit, this will work out nicely. It's a WOA from a Wilson blank. It will outshoot most people. The BCM someone posted above is very similar, except this one is offered with an F marked FSB.

    http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=sho...product_id=774
    Have you ever used an ER Shaw barrel?

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightvisionary View Post
    Have you ever used an ER Shaw barrel?
    Not in years. I don't buy shit parts. Does this sufficiently answer your question? Did M4C get bit by the retard bug today?

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by a0cake View Post
    Not in years. I don't buy shit parts. Does this sufficiently answer your question? Did M4C get bit by the retard bug today?
    What is your definition of "Shit Parts"?

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightvisionary View Post
    What is your definition of "Shit Parts"?
    You bought an ER Shaw, didn't you?

    ER Shaw makes barrels for a LOT of companies. The company provides the specs (and sometimes the tooling to go with it) and ER Shaw makes the barrels to those specs (It appears, from strictly Anecdotal evidence...that ER Shaw may pay more / less attention to detail based on WHO the barrels are for...then of course the company who receives the barrels has its own individual Q/C measures, which may be good...or not.) It's a similar model to how Criterion operates, except Criterion does it better.

    The problem with ER Shaw is consistency. This is why I said they're a crapshoot earlier. It doesn't take a long time in the precision rifle community to understand and acknowledge this. Just because a bunch of dudes on a website might jump in and say "My ER Shaw shoots 1/2 MOA Groups" or "ER Shaw has made barrels for Colt" doesn't mean anything. They were fortunate with their sample, made for THAT PARTICULAR CLIENT of ER Shaw. Many people haven't been. As a whole, there are issues with ER Shaw barrels.

    Common problems:

    - Threads not concentric to the bore.

    - "Terrain features," tool marks, rough spots in the bores leading to early and excessive fouling.

    - Burs on the gas ports.

    -Inconsistent rate of twist throughout the length of the bore (common problem for low grade button rifled barrels).

    I understand that people who own these barrels may get butthurt. Their particular examples may work fine. Good for them. The point is that the next guy who buys one may not be able to get it under 3 MOA despite every attempt.

    The OP has quality options available from FN, BCM, and other companies known for their consistent quality.

    I've explained why I consider ER Shaw to be "shit parts," commonly found on abortions like Model 1 Sales rifles and Red Jacket Shoot Wrong Katanas.

    Now you explain why the OP should buy a barrel (The AR Stoner / ER Shaw that you recommended) that may or may not perform when these other options are available. AR-Stoner is basically Midway's sister / house company. They source all kinds of shit quality components from shit quality manufacturers, and then sell it by using Eugene Stoner's name. I don't like that. Do you think that this company, who profits off of selling junk, is going to have a Q/C process in place to deal with the inconsistencies that their barrel source (ER Shaw) produces? The answer is no, and that's why a lot of people have had to send back AR-Stoner / Shaw barrels multiple times before getting one that works.

    This is the internet, but your words still carry weight. What you say has consequences. Somebody might go buy the POS you recommended because they assume you know what you're talking about.
    Last edited by a0cake; 11-24-11 at 01:42.

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by ContractSoldier View Post
    What's going on with all the 20" barrels, they all seem to be drying up.

    While I prefer to use a BCM 20 inch barrel with 1 /7 twist, F marked front sight base and M4 feed ramps, their barrels have been sold out for some time. CMMG seems to no longer have them on their web site and Bushmaster's 20" government profile barrel with no 1/7 twist + no M4 feed ramps + no F marked front sight base = I'm not buying it for my A4 build.

    What's going on here?
    You can get the bushmaster barrels in gi profile with 1/7 twist and m4 feedramps. PK sells complete uppers with them from time to time. If you want one directly from bushmaster you need to phone in the order. PK sells their complete upper with a f fsb but I don't know if they install it or get it from bushmaster that way. Right now it isn't on their site but it does show up when they have stock.

    Past that you can get a bcm barrel and install your own fsb or get a complete upper when they have them. Palmetto sells at least complete uppers with fn barrels with those specs. I can't seem to hit their site right now so I'm not positive if they will just sell a barrel or not. Palmetto does have a round handguard cap as they are using the same cap as they do on the other guns. It is strange but shouldn't cause a problem. Palmetto did say on TOS that they had ordered the correct caps but I haven't seen if they have received them yet or are giving people the option.

    It seems most of the quality 20 inch barrels in gi have m4 feedramps even through they are not needed and not on the military rifles.

    Finally Grant on here said something about trying to get colt to make a complete 20 inch rifle with a gi profile barrel. I know it isn't what you were looking for but it is something to hope for.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by a0cake View Post
    You bought an ER Shaw, didn't you?

    ER Shaw makes barrels for a LOT of companies. The company provides the specs (and sometimes the tooling to go with it) and ER Shaw makes the barrels to those specs (It appears, from strictly Anecdotal evidence...that ER Shaw may pay more / less attention to detail based on WHO the barrels are for...then of course the company who receives the barrels has its own individual Q/C measures, which may be good...or not.) It's a similar model to how Criterion operates, except Criterion does it better.

    The problem with ER Shaw is consistency. This is why I said they're a crapshoot earlier. It doesn't take a long time in the precision rifle community to understand and acknowledge this. Just because a bunch of dudes on a website might jump in and say "My ER Shaw shoots 1/2 MOA Groups" or "ER Shaw has made barrels for Colt" doesn't mean anything. They were fortunate with their sample, made for THAT PARTICULAR CLIENT of ER Shaw. Many people haven't been. As a whole, there are issues with ER Shaw barrels.

    Common problems:

    - Threads not concentric to the bore.

    - "Terrain features," tool marks, rough spots in the bores leading to early and excessive fouling.

    - Burs on the gas ports.

    -Inconsistent rate of twist throughout the length of the bore (common problem for low grade button rifled barrels).

    I understand that people who own these barrels may get butthurt. Their particular examples may work fine. Good for them. The point is that the next guy who buys one may not be able to get it under 3 MOA despite every attempt.

    The OP has quality options available from FN, BCM, and other companies known for their consistent quality.
    OP already stated those are not options that are readily available for a build. I simply told the OP where a barrel fitting his stated need was in stock and ready to ship.


    I've explained why I consider ER Shaw to be "shit parts," commonly found on abortions like Model 1 Sales rifles and Red Jacket Shoot Wrong Katanas.

    Now you explain why the OP should buy a barrel (The AR Stoner / ER Shaw that you recommended) that may or may not perform when these other options are available. AR-Stoner is basically Midway's sister / house company. They source all kinds of shit quality components from shit quality manufacturers, and then sell it by using Eugene Stoner's name. I don't like that. Do you think that this company, who profits off of selling junk, is going to have a Q/C process in place to deal with the inconsistencies that their barrel source (ER Shaw) produces? The answer is no, and that's why a lot of people have had to send back AR-Stoner / Shaw barrels multiple times before getting one that works.

    Midway sells many items from Noveske,Hart, Troy, Daniel Defense etc, etc , etc. Is ER shaw on par with a Hart or Shilen barrel? Obviously not but not every rifle needs a hart or Shilen barrel.

    Judging from the large number of user reviews submitted at Midway for the AR Stoner barrels, people who actually purchased and use the barrels are quite satisfied with them. The overall satisfaction rating seem to be just slightly less than that given for Daniel Defense barrels. However the AR stoner/ER Shaw barrels are offered in a much wider variety such as 20 inch govt profile as the OP was searching for.


    This is the internet, but your words still carry weight. What you say has consequences. Somebody might go buy the POS you recommended because they assume you know what you're talking about.
    Someone may also pass on a good shooting barrel based on the assumption that you know what you are talking about.
    Later alligator. Im off to load some 6x45 to shoot through my AR/Stoner - ER Shaw barrel ;-)
    Last edited by Nightvisionary; 11-24-11 at 03:47.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by PalmettoStateArmory View Post
    The barrel is made by FN at their facility here in SC.
    Thanks to everyone that's help out so far.

    Palmetto State Armory, thanks for taking the time out of your busy schedule to post a reply in reference to your barrel. The fact that the barrel is made by FN, who to the best of my knowledge, make's all of the parts for the new military M16 rifles, is a good buying point for me.

    I would imagine that the barrel is 4150 chrome-moly vanadium steel?

    I'm leaning toward going with your barrel, made by FN.
    Last edited by ContractSoldier; 11-24-11 at 06:01.

  8. #28
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    Really? A Bushmaster barrel. Unless they have changed they still are not;

    1. Individually HP/MPI tested.

    2. Do not always have 5.56 chambers (regardless of the trash they stamp on their barrels).

    3. Almost always are 1/9.


    Quote Originally Posted by ccosby View Post
    You can get the bushmaster barrels in gi
    profile with 1/7 twist and m4 feedramps. PK sells complete uppers with them from time to time. If you want one directly from bushmaster you need to phone in the order. PK sells their complete upper with a f fsb but I don't know if they install it or get it from bushmaster that way. Right now it isn't on their site but it does show up when they have stock.

    Past that you can get a bcm barrel and install your own fsb or get a complete upper when they have them. Palmetto sells at least complete uppers with fn barrels with those specs. I can't seem to hit their site right now so I'm not positive if they will just sell a barrel or not. Palmetto does have a round handguard cap as they are using the same cap as they do on the other guns. It is strange but shouldn't cause a problem. Palmetto did say on TOS that they had ordered the correct caps but I haven't seen if they have received them yet or are giving people the option.

    It seems most of the quality 20 inch barrels in gi have m4 feedramps even through they are not needed and not on the military rifles.

    Finally Grant on here said something about trying to get colt to make a complete 20 inch rifle with a gi profile barrel. I know it isn't what you were looking for but it is something to hope for.



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  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iraqgunz View Post
    Really? A Bushmaster barrel. Unless they have changed they still are not;

    1. Individually HP/MPI tested.

    2. Do not always have 5.56 chambers (regardless of the trash they stamp on their barrels).

    3. Almost always are 1/9.
    The OP mentioned them and I corrected him/her saying that they do make a 1/7 twist and I've seen them with a f fsb although I did say I wasn't sure if they put it on them or PK firearms did.

    He was asking about gi profile 20 inch barrels. They are one of the few that makes them. Personally I'd go with bcm barrel or the fn barrel from palmetto which I now see you can get as a bare barrel(their site was down when I posted last night).

    In my case I have a 20 inch complete bcm rifle(only thing not from bcm is the a2 stock which came from armalite). I'm building another 20 inch rifle that I wanted a fixed carry handle on as a range toy. I want a quality 20 inch barrel new with rifle feed ramps. Yea talk about having no options. I'll end up with one of the two barrels listed above and get a colt a2 upper with m4 feed ramps or something to mount it to. That or order a c7 upper from bushmaster as I can get them with m4 feed ramps(have a c7 upper now without them which is why I wanted rifle feed ramps).

  10. #30
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    While I have not bought a barrel from Palmetto, I have bought some other parts from them and had good dealings.
    http://palmettostatearmory.com/2528.php

    For most of my other needs I usually go to Rainier. I have one of their Ultra Match barrels in 16in and have been pleased with them.
    They have a WOA in SDM profile using a Wilson blank
    WOA 20in

    Or the Rainier Ultra Match based on a Schillen barrel blank. (pretty sure that WOA does the finishing for them too.)
    Rainier SDM 20 Schillen blank

    WOA also has some more standard profiles without the flutes for less too.WOA barrels

    If you are wanting to try out Polygonal groove barrels, I have heard good things about Black Hole Weaponry.
    Black hole barrels

    It really depends on your price point and whether you want stainless or chrome. Most of the time when I think of 20in barrels, I tend to think of high accuracy and lower round count uses. Which would I would favor stainless. But not sure what your plans are.

    If anyone disagrees, feel free to post why, I am always willing to listen and learn.
    "You done good. Remember the rules of home gun smithing: Measure it with a micrometer, mark it with chalk, cut it with a torch/dremel, grind it to fit, paint it to match with a sharpie!"

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