Dedicated Suppressed AR vs. Standard AR Suppressed Results

[Clint]

It would be interesting to compare the "gas to face" from an otherwise identical DI upper configured with a Superlative Arms adjustable gas block to the piston version.

A properly setup dedicated suppressed DI AR has virtually no gas and can be very pleasant to shoot.

I’m coming back around to the idea of piston guns. I got a great deal on a Superlative Arms adjustable bleed piston system and after installing it and shooting it I found it’s an amazing way to reduce gas to the face. So I bought a PWS MK111 Mod 1 and I really like that one, also, though it is a tad more gassy, it’s super easy to switch. At this point I’m only shooting my AR for fun, training, and the one in a million chance of shtf so I’m more free to screw around with different builds.

[Clint]

Setup one with the AGB and one with an EZTUNE gas tube.

Shoot 'em side by side and share your experience.

I have two 10.5 SBR's that are gassy that I am taking out Saturday and trying to decide if I want adjustable gas block, (which I have at home) or try one of Clints tubes which have been fabulous with my MWS guns.

BRT is a legit option.

PB

[Clint]

Yes, the adjustable carrier does work to reduce bolt velocity, however there are a couple side effects.

#1 the adjustment mechanism leaks and reduces the gas drive in the "normal" setting.

We tested this back to back with a BCM BCG.

The mil-spec BCG produced 2:30 ejection and the adjustable BCG produced 4:00 ejection and notably slower bolt velocity.

When sizing EZTUNE gas tubes, we go up one size to compensate and get the same level of Gas Drive.

This isn't a huge deal, but isn't exactly expected either.

For over gassed uppers, this leakage could actually be considered a benefit.

#2 the gas venting in the suppressed setting is directly adjacent to the shooter's ear and extremely loud.

Again, we tested it in the full suppressed setting without a suppressor attached.

The bolt didn't move or eject the brass, as expected.

What wasn't expected was the notable ear ringing / discomfort in one ear through the usual Surefire EP4 hearing protection.

Again, this was without the suppressor attached, so it should represent the minimum level of ejection port noise produced.

The EP4 are admittedly not "heavy duty" hearing protection, but are completely sufficient for all other shooting.

#3 It requires a tool to adjust.

This may be a minor quibble, but Murphy's Law is in full effect whenever you're in the field.


In summary, the adjustable carrier is a viable solution.

However, in many cases it's simpler and easier to setup an upper for 50/50 suppressed use and (optionally) just swap in a heavy buffer when suppressed.

Allow me to play Devil’s Advocate for a moment. For a part-time suppressor host or for one that the possessor does not want to/can’t change a gas tube, the Bootleg carrier actually works very well. Much better than I expected. Much better than the LMT or Lantac BCGs in that role. Of course, I started out with a reasonably ported barrel that was advertised as a silencer barrel. But I wouldn’t call it a band-aid, because it works so well, although I don’t think that’s the one you were talking about.

I absolutely agree that the EZ Tune or simply a properly ported barrel is the best first-line solution to the full-time suppressor host, which is of course the topic at hand. I put the gas tubes on almost every rifle I have, and so do some of my friends.

[1168]

Yes, the adjustable carrier does work to reduce bolt velocity, however there are a couple side effects.

#1 the adjustment mechanism leaks and reduces the gas drive in the "normal" setting.

We tested this back to back with a BCM BCG.

The mil-spec BCG produced 2:30 ejection and the adjustable BCG produced 4:00 ejection and notably slower bolt velocity.

When sizing EZTUNE gas tubes, we go up one size to compensate and get the same level of Gas Drive.

This isn't a huge deal, but isn't exactly expected either.

For over gassed uppers, this leakage could actually be considered a benefit.

#2 the gas venting in the suppressed setting is directly adjacent to the shooter's ear and extremely loud.

Again, we tested it in the full suppressed setting without a suppressor attached.

The bolt didn't move or eject the brass, as expected.

What wasn't expected was the notable ear ringing / discomfort in one ear through the usual Surefire EP4 hearing protection.

Again, this was without the suppressor attached, so it should represent the minimum level of ejection port noise produced.

The EP4 are admittedly not "heavy duty" hearing protection, but are completely sufficient for all other shooting.

#3 It requires a tool to adjust.

This may be a minor quibble, but Murphy's Law is in full effect whenever you're in the field.


In summary, the adjustable carrier is a viable solution.

However, in many cases it's simpler and easier to setup an upper for 50/50 suppressed use and (optionally) just swap in a heavy buffer when suppressed.

Which ones have you tested? I only have the Bootleg.

1)it’ll run unsuppressed in the unsuppressed setting on a Hodge .0625” 12.5”, so I’m surprised to hear about the leakage.
2)no, it sounds exactly like its sister 12.3” with one of your 0.059” tubes on setting 3, and on setting 2 like its other sibling 12.5” with one of your mixed-use tubes. The design appears to cut off gas, not increase venting. Perhaps I’m wrong and it’ll do what you’re describing on a different barrel.
3)yes, it does require a tool, such as a screwdriver through the ejection port. The rim of a cartridge will work if you pull it out of the receiver. I’d consider it to be less reliant on tools than some other approaches.

Do these things come in different flavors? I’ll admit, I was skeptical at first.

[Eurodriver]

I have the Gemtech on a 10.3” Centurion and a Gemtech on a 12.5” Noveske and a Gemtech on a 16” BCM and a Gemtech on a 11.5” BCM.

With the unsuppressed setting on and without a can there is absolutely a reduction is carrier velocity/felt recoil on all of them. This has never resulted in a failure however. I wonder how it would be with some weak .223 Tula in the cold though.

[Clint]

4 position Bootleg.

Tested only on setting 1 (U) and 4 (S).

Settings 2 and 3 may perform some kind of restriction and act differently than setting 4(S), which definitely vents gas.

Which ones have you tested? I only have the Bootleg.

1)it’ll run unsuppressed in the unsuppressed setting on a Hodge .0625” 12.5”, so I’m surprised to hear about the leakage.
2)no, it sounds exactly like its sister 12.3” with one of your 0.059” tubes on setting 3, and on setting 2 like its other sibling 12.5” with one of your mixed-use tubes. The design appears to cut off gas, not increase venting. Perhaps I’m wrong and it’ll do what you’re describing on a different barrel.
3)yes, it does require a tool, such as a screwdriver through the ejection port. The rim of a cartridge will work if you pull it out of the receiver. I’d consider it to be less reliant on tools than some other approaches.

Do these things come in different flavors? I’ll admit, I was skeptical at first.

[Pappabear]

My opinion is a quality adjustable gas block is the best option but it cost a lot more and takes a bit more work setting up. Both putting on the barrel and working up the perfect setting at the range. Clint's tubes are very simple and effective.

PB

[Todd.K]

It would be interesting to compare the "gas to face" from an otherwise identical DI upper configured with a Superlative Arms adjustable gas block to the piston version.

A properly setup dedicated suppressed DI AR has virtually no gas and can be very pleasant to shoot.

Cyclic rate and how fast extraction happens plays a big role. A huge amount of the gas to face comes through the bore.

Some piston designs actually increase the cyclic rate suppressed much more than DI.

I think the LMT enhanced carrier with it’s longer cam pin slot should delay extraction and might reduce gas to face. I haven’t bothered trying it out because your last point is so true. Reducing the gas on a standard DI system makes them pleasant to shoot suppressed.

[Pappabear]

And finding LMT Enhanced carriers is unicorn territory. I was fortunate to have had a LGS that kept them in stock for quite a while. I snatched a bunch overtime. But the two 10.5’s we shot this weekend had A5 buffers with LMT EBCG and gas was no issue but they felt snappy as fck. It was a windy day so gas was blown away, but I remember it being an issue.

And there is more to the EBCG than just gas control.

PB

[1168]

No, the LMT solution is not a full solution.