Do "Poor People" Have All Their Constitutional Rights...?

[SteyrAUG]

OK first things first, by "poor people" I mean ONLY THAT. I don't mean convicted felons, drug addicts, mental people or anything else. I mean "poor people."

For the purpose of this discussion a man who simply lost his job and most of his savings for whatever reason.

1. If he doesn't own a car and doesn't have a CCW permit how does he get his gun and ammunition to a range legally to shoot? What about if he is simply taking it to his buddies house? 200 years ago he could have slung his loaded weapon and legally went anywhere.

2. If he is homeless and has no physical address how can he legally purchase a firearm? How does he fill out a 4473 with no proof of residency? 200 years ago no such regulation existed.

3. If he is homeless how does he legally possess and store his firearm? How does he legally keep it ready to defend his life just as any homeowner would? Without a physical address he could not get a CCW if he wanted to. Does that mean he no longer has the right to be armed and defend himself? 200 years ago homeless people who we called "pioneers" always had their weapons.

4. If the police encounter and search such a person, will they confiscate his property? Is the crime simply being "poor" and "armed"?

[montanadave]

The inability to show proof of residency not only affects an individual's right to bear arms, but their right to vote as well.

[Nightvisionary]

OK first things first, by "poor people" I mean ONLY THAT. I don't mean convicted felons, drug addicts, mental people or anything else. I mean "poor people."

For the purpose of this discussion a man who simply lost his job and most of his savings for whatever reason.

1. If he doesn't own a car and doesn't have a CCW permit how does he get his gun and ammunition to a range legally to shoot? What about if he is simply taking it to his buddies house? 200 years ago he could have slung his loaded weapon and legally went anywhere.

2. If he is homeless and has no physical address how can he legally purchase a firearm? How does he fill out a 4473 with no proof of residency? 200 years ago no such regulation existed.

3. If he is homeless how does he legally possess and store his firearm? How does he legally keep it ready to defend his life just as any homeowner would? Without a physical address he could not get a CCW if he wanted to. Does that mean he no longer has the right to be armed and defend himself? 200 years ago homeless people who we called "pioneers" always had their weapons.

4. If the police encounter and search such a person, will they confiscate his property? Is the crime simply being "poor" and "armed"?

If someone is so poor they cannot afford a roof over their head or a vehicle how are they going to afford the cost of range memberships, CCW fees, ammunition, and firearms?

In many states homeless are permitted to use the address of the bridge they live under when enrolling for state benefits.

In the end worrying about the homeless is slightly behind the amount of time I spend worrying about the possibilty of the Yellowstone super volcano erupting in my lifetime. There are just so many more immediate issues on my plate that I will leave this one to the ACLU lawyers.

[Nightvisionary]

The inability to show proof of residency not only affects an individual's right to bear arms, but their right to vote as well.

That is untrue in most states that I am aware of.

[SteyrAUG]

If someone is so poor they cannot afford a roof over their head or a vehicle how are they going to afford the cost of range memberships, CCW fees, ammunition, and firearms?

In many states homeless are permitted to use the address of the bridge they live under when enrolling for state benefits.

In the end worrying about the homeless is slightly behind the amount of time I spend worrying about the possibilty of the Yellowstone super volcano erupting in my lifetime. There are just so many more immediate issues on my plate that I will leave this one to the ACLU lawyers.

I imagine if most of us were homeless, we'd do whatever is necessary to budget a means of personal protection, especially given how "at risk" homeless people are.

I surmise a day laborer could more effectively save up for a handgun than a car or a apartment. So does that fact that he might live under a bridge mean he should not be allowed to own a firearm?

I specifically raised the issue of CCW and how it's cost could be construed as infringement.

And I understand most aren't concerned with the rights of others unless it potentially effects them.

[chadbag]

The inability to show proof of residency not only affects an individual's right to bear arms, but their right to vote as well.

Really? Lots of states (and the DOJ) would beg to differ...

[chadbag]

If someone is so poor they cannot afford a roof over their head or a vehicle how are they going to afford the cost of range memberships, CCW fees, ammunition, and firearms?

In many states homeless are permitted to use the address of the bridge they live under when enrolling for state benefits.

In the end worrying about the homeless is slightly behind the amount of time I spend worrying about the possibilty of the Yellowstone super volcano erupting in my lifetime. There are just so many more immediate issues on my plate that I will leave this one to the ACLU lawyers.

I think you are missing SteyrAUG's point...

[Honu]

none of this is a poor problem ! its what our gov has become !

Glenn Beck could not get a permit in NY to carry ?
yet he is rich as heck and others can get a permit ? hmmmmm again gov issue not poor issue

if I am rich and buy 200 guns one day will the gov come knocking ? again I bet they will


again not a poor issue a gov issue of CONTROL !!!



flip that around why should poor people get free gov money !!! OH WAIT its not free they are taking it from me !!!
why should they get school I pay for !
food I pay for !!!

do poor people have more rights than I do !!!!

the gov cant come seize their home ! yet they can with me !

again poor has nothing to do with any rights we have

[armakraut]

For a long time in some states you couldn't vote unless you owned property. Which is probably not a bad standard, but a better standard these days would be either denying votes to those that take more government benefits than they earn in reportable income, or giving an extra vote to productive citizens.

But yeah, considering how the constitution was written so that you could pretty much buy, own and carry whatever you wanted, wherever you wanted, unless you were in jail... it's all one big infringement. 4473's, background checks, FFL's, CCW's, Licenses to manufacture, Licenses to import, Special Occupation Taxes, NFA stamps, etc. All highly unconstitutional boom hopping.

People don't want to live in a world where the government isn't their agent of persecution against individuals that offend their sensibilities. So whenever left socialism and right socialism goals meet up our reward is tyranny (aka bipartisan legislation).

[Nightvisionary]

The homeless live outside of society due to their own choices. The vast majority are homeless due to drug/alcohol addiction, mental health issues, criminal records or all three. All three of which are potential disqualifiers for firearm ownership in the first place. This is the perfect example of a straw man argument.

If you are homeless than you are certainly committing trespass wherever you choose to lay your head at night whether it be public property or private. Since homeless have no lawful claim to real estate thEY have no right to possess firearms while trespassing on the property of others.