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Thread: Gun sluggish/problems chambering in "cold"

  1. #71
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    I've used marine wheel bearing grease on my action spring for years now with no issue such as the one described in the OP and I live in an area that goes to extremes. We can get 110 plus degrees in summer and right now as I speak it's 28 degrees and dropping.

    I recently switched to fully synthetic Amsoil grease due to it's temperature range and added protectants that are similar to the protectants in marine wheel bearing grease which is a must up here in the northwet to keep parts from rusting.

    So far it has kept my guns running like a raped ape regardless of the temp, suppressed or unsuppressed, clean and dirty alike.

    I'm liking this Amsoil, even if it's made by the amway people.

  2. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrumpyM4 View Post
    I've used marine wheel bearing grease on my action spring for years now with no issue such as the one described in the OP and I live in an area that goes to extremes. We can get 110 plus degrees in summer and right now as I speak it's 28 degrees and dropping.

    I recently switched to fully synthetic Amsoil grease due to it's temperature range and added protectants that are similar to the protectants in marine wheel bearing grease which is a must up here in the northwet to keep parts from rusting.

    So far it has kept my guns running like a raped ape regardless of the temp, suppressed or unsuppressed, clean and dirty alike.

    I'm liking this Amsoil, even if it's made by the amway people.
    Did you read the thread? It's not an issue of the gun "running." The gun runs well as in once it's loaded it shoots to empty. It's an issue with the first cartridge being stripped off of a new magazine.

  3. #73
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    Why let something as bothersome as the actual point of the original post get in the way of people with the overwhelming urge to type random things?

  4. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by thopkins22 View Post
    Did you read the thread? It's not an issue of the gun "running." The gun runs well as in once it's loaded it shoots to empty. It's an issue with the first cartridge being stripped off of a new magazine.
    That would suggest a couple of things to me. Either an insufficient action spring or a sharp barrel extension where the edges of the 5 and 7 O'Clock locking recesses are 'biting' the jacket of the bullet and/or possibly a rough feed ramp. just enough of a problem when the bolt is released from the bolt catch but not enough to stop it when released from full compression.

    I wll say this much, on every barrel I mount, I break the edges on these recesses with some small diamond dust files and then dremel-polish the shit out of the feed ramps and the edges of the 5 and 7 O'Clock recesses.
    Last edited by Heavy Metal; 01-19-12 at 10:48.
    My brother saw Deliverance and bought a Bow. I saw Deliverance and bought an AR-15.

  5. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by thopkins22 View Post
    Did you read the thread? It's not an issue of the gun "running." The gun runs well as in once it's loaded it shoots to empty. It's an issue with the first cartridge being stripped off of a new magazine.
    Yes I read the thread. The OP was concerned about his choice of lube and the temps of his area.

    Therefore I mentioned that the lube I use has proven itself across a variety of temps and my guns do not have the same issue that his does regardless of the temp. In other words, I was giving him another option of lube that may help prevent the issues he is experiencing.

    Clear enough for you or do I need to break out the crayons and construction paper?

  6. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrumpyM4 View Post
    Yes I read the thread. The OP was concerned about his choice of lube and the temps of his area.

    Therefore I mentioned that the lube I use has proven itself across a variety of temps and my guns do not have the same issue that his does regardless of the temp. In other words, I was giving him another option of lube that may help prevent the issues he is experiencing.

    Clear enough for you or do I need to break out the crayons and construction paper?
    I shoot side by side with him, using the exact same lubricant. Albeit not suppressed nearly as much. No issues, in fact last night his gun was lubricated with the lighter Slip 2k instead of the EWL(which should still be fine WAY colder than we're experiencing.)

    The crayons would have been helpful the first go-round when your post was easily interpreted as meaning that the issue reared up when firing the gun...not now.

  7. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by thopkins22 View Post
    I shoot side by side with him, using the exact same lubricant. Albeit not suppressed nearly as much. No issues, in fact last night his gun was lubricated with the lighter Slip 2k instead of the EWL(which should still be fine WAY colder than we're experiencing.)

    The crayons would have been helpful the first go-round when your post was easily interpreted as meaning that the issue reared up when firing the gun...not now.
    Is cool. I happen to like crayons and construction paper. Reminds me of better days.

    To be honest, you're right, his choice of lubricant *should* work fine in the given temps he's talked about.

    That being said, this leads me to believe that the issue is one with the gun as others have pointed out and the temps are just the proverbial straw that broke the camels back.

    Let me put it this way...... One time, for shits and giggles, I tried a grease in my M4 that is used on the missile tube hatches of boomers. It was a very thick and extremely tacky (sticks to everything and super hard to clean off), but was super slick (when the parts in question was moving slowly). It was designed to keep a system lubed at low temperatures, in corrosive environments, and under extreme pressure (under the ice caps, salt water, and in the depths of the oceans).

    When I tried this grease, it was at a winter shoot where the tems were in the 20s and it was snowing. Cold, the gun ran slooooooooow. I mean you could watch the bolt schloop forward and strip the round off of the magazine (Pmags) as if in slow motion when the bolt was dropped manually for the first time. When the rifle was fired, it ran clunky until it warmed up and then it ran normally.

    Point being is that it still ran. Even cold and, for lack of a better term, "goopy". Meaning that a gun that is running up to spec and has all parts within specified operating perameters will still work properly even with thickened lube.

    All said and done, I hope RetreatHell gets this figured out satisfactorily.

  8. #78
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    Alright, so here are a couple pics from my and thopkins22's range trip the other night.


    This was the first time it happened that night, and it was after firing around 250+ rounds suppressed. It didn't happen while running my painted BCM lower (at least not that I remember) for the previous hour or so. We actually took a break and I swapped lowers to a Larue billet lower. But I'm pretty positive it would have soon because it was beginning to load REALLY slowly. But it did continue feeding when manually chambering. I just wanted to swap to another lower which had not yet been shot with a suppressed upper installed to see if the "fresh" lower would also start off great and quickly begin slowing down. And it did. I expect to have to reapply lube when running suppressed every 4-500 rounds, but the upper components don't seem to be the problem here (although I'm not saying something can't be wrong).

    This is a Larue lower and it was nice and clean and felt great at first. But after a few mags (maybe 3?) I could tell it was going to start having issues very soon, and it did. Note that I also reapplied lube generously to the upper's inside and CH and BCG before swapping lowers, as the Slip 2000 lube had burned off almost all the inside of the upper and the part of the bolt that is visible.






    And here are 3 videos linked below. Now you'll all be able to see what I'm actually talking about here.

    Video 1:
    http://youtu.be/OD_i8Jvf810

    Video 2:
    http://youtu.be/UQ1nkDr5aWQ


    Here in video 3 you'll see something that I'm friggin' clueless as to how the hell it happens! I've only seen this happen a few times. The round gets chambered but is loose in the chamber and the bolt never grabs a hold of it. WTF?!

    Video 3:
    http://youtu.be/QLKuvQgBw7M


    So there you are... If you read the complete original post AND have also followed this thread AND also are in the know AND also have an idea as to what's going on and how to (possibly) remedy it, please do feel free to fill my ass in. Thanks!


    ****And BTW Thomas, if I'm not remembering something correctly or I said something wrong about the sequence of events, or you remember shit differently, please feel free to correct me. My memory sucks.
    S/F
    Paul

  9. #79
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    I have tried to follow with this thread as I was curious as well as to what was going on. I cannot for the life of me figure out what is causing this- internet diagnosis and all.

    Video 3 was interesting in that it seems as if there may be too much tension on the extractor which is why it wouldn't grab the rim.

    If you don' mind, do a little recap for me.

    1. How many rounds through this AR total (SWAG)?

    2. What exactly is your extractor set up? Colt, BCM, ?? O-ring or no O-ring?

    3. This is only happening in cold weather and not when it's warmer?

    4. I will also agree with a few others here. The temps you are experiencing aren't "cold" per se and I know that I have experienced similar conditions in Arizona and overseas.

    5. Have you noticed any change in the accuracy of the weapon from when you first started shooting it?

    6. Can you see any abnormal or odd wear in the chamber extension or the bolt lugs?


    I have some possible suspicions, but I am going to hold them to myself for the moment.



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  10. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by decodeddiesel View Post
    This might really steer me away from the 14.5 middy as I often venture into the mountains in 0F weather when shooting in the winter (no one else is crazy enough to go in such weather so I have the places to myself).
    I cannot see how the gas system would affect the function of chambering the first round from a mag


    As mentioned, check the spring length. EWL should be good-to-go for those temps, I use it all winter, and we actually have winter here

    Buffer springs are one of the things I used to cheap out on, but have learned that it is one of the areas where quality really shines. I buy my springs from SAW, Colt OEM only
    Last edited by eternal24k; 01-20-12 at 08:19. Reason: grammar

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