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Thread: Americans Strongly Dislike PC Culture

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    Americans Strongly Dislike PC Culture

    I read this article from The Atlantic on the Real Clear Politics site. The author has a left lean which is not necessarily an issue when discussing the results of the study she is outlining.

    It boils down to this for both sides: In a democracy, it is difficult to win fellow citizens over to your own side, or to build public support to remedy injustices that remain all too real, when you fundamentally misunderstand how they see the world.

    I'm a member of the 2/3's of Americans who don't belong to either the progessive activist or the devoted conservative camps, the article calls us the exhausted majority.

    Anyways, I think it was an informative article. Links at the end>

    Americans Strongly Dislike PC Culture

    Youth isn’t a good proxy for support of political correctness, and race isn’t either.


    Yascha Mounk = Lecturer on government at Harvard University

    On social media, the country seems to divide into two neat camps: Call them the woke and the resentful. Team Resentment is manned—pun very much intended—by people who are predominantly old and almost exclusively white. Team Woke is young, likely to be female, and predominantly black, brown, or Asian (though white “allies” do their dutiful part). These teams are roughly equal in number, and they disagree most vehemently, as well as most routinely, about the catchall known as political correctness.

    Reality is nothing like this. As scholars Stephen Hawkins, Daniel Yudkin, Miriam Juan-Torres, and Tim Dixon argue in a report published Wednesday, Hidden Tribes: A Study of America’s Polarized Landscape, most Americans don’t fit into either of these camps. They also share more common ground than the daily fights on social media might suggest—including a general aversion to PC culture.

    If you look at what Americans have to say on issues such as immigration, the extent of white privilege, and the prevalence of sexual harassment, the authors argue, seven distinct clusters emerge: progressive activists, traditional liberals, passive liberals, the politically disengaged, moderates, traditional conservatives, and devoted conservatives.

    According to the report:

    25 percent of Americans are traditional or devoted conservatives, and their views are far outside the American mainstream.

    Some 8 percent of Americans are progressive activists, and their views are even less typical.

    By contrast, the two-thirds of Americans who don’t belong to either extreme constitute an “exhausted majority.” Their members “share a sense of fatigue with our polarized national conversation, a willingness to be flexible in their political viewpoints, and a lack of voice in the national conversation.”

    Most members of the “exhausted majority,” and then some, dislike political correctness. Among the general population, a full 80 percent believe that “political correctness is a problem in our country.” Even young people are uncomfortable with it, including 74 percent ages 24 to 29, and 79 percent under age 24. On this particular issue, the woke are in a clear minority across all ages.

    Youth isn’t a good proxy for support of political correctness—and it turns out race isn’t, either.


    Whites are ever so slightly less likely than average to believe that political correctness is a problem in the country: 79 percent of them share this sentiment. Instead, it is Asians (82 percent), Hispanics (87percent), and American Indians (88 percent) who are most likely to oppose political correctness. As one 40-year-old American Indian in Oklahoma said in his focus group, according to the report:

    It seems like everyday you wake up something has changed … Do you say Jew? Or Jewish? Is it a black guy? African-American? … You are on your toes because you never know what to say. So political correctness in that sense is scary.

    The one part of the standard narrative that the data partially affirm is that African Americans are most likely to support political correctness. But the difference between them and other groups is much smaller than generally supposed: Three quarters of African Americans oppose political correctness. This means that they are only four percentage points less likely than whites, and only five percentage points less likely than the average, to believe that political correctness is a problem.

    If age and race do not predict support for political correctness, what does? Income and education.

    While 83 percent of respondents who make less than $50,000 dislike political correctness, just 70 percent of those who make more than $100,000 are skeptical about it
    .

    And while 87 percent who have never attended college think that political correctness has grown to be a problem, only 66 percent of those with a postgraduate degree share that sentiment.

    Political tribe—as defined by the authors—is an even better predictor of views on political correctness. Among devoted conservatives, 97 percent believe that political correctness is a problem. Among traditional liberals, 61 percent do. Progressive activists are the only group that strongly backs political correctness: Only 30 percent see it as a problem.

    So what does this group look like? Compared with the rest of the (nationally representative) polling sample, progressive activists are much more likely to be rich, highly educated—and white. They are nearly twice as likely as the average to make more than $100,000 a year. They are nearly three times as likely to have a postgraduate degree. And while 12 percent of the overall sample in the study is African American, only 3 percent of progressive activists are. With the exception of the small tribe of devoted conservatives, progressive activists are the most racially homogeneous group in the country.

    One obvious question is what people mean by “political correctness.” In the extended interviews and focus groups, participants made clear that they were concerned about their day-to-day ability to express themselves: They worry that a lack of familiarity with a topic, or an unthinking word choice, could lead to serious social sanctions for them. But since the survey question did not define political correctness for respondents, we cannot be sure what, exactly, the 80 percent of Americans who regard it as a problem have in mind.

    There is, however, plenty of additional support for the idea that the social views of most Americans are not nearly as neatly divided by age or race as is commonly believed. According to the Pew Research Center, for example, only 26 percent of black Americans consider themselves liberal. And in the More in Common study, nearly half of Latinos argued that “many people nowadays are too sensitive to how Muslims are treated,” while two in five African Americans agreed that “immigration nowadays is bad for America.”

    In the days before “Hidden Tribes” was published, I ran a little experiment on Twitter, asking my followers to guess what percentage of Americans believe that political correctness is a problem in this country. The results were striking: Nearly all of my followers underestimated the extent to which most Americans reject political correctness. Only 6 percent gave the right answer. (When I asked them how people of color regard political correctness, their guesses were, unsurprisingly, even more wildly off.)

    Obviously, my followers on Twitter are not a representative sample of America. But as their largely supportive feelings about political correctness indicate, they are probably a decent approximation for a particular intellectual milieu to which I also belong: politically engaged, highly educated, left-leaning Americans—the kinds of people, in other words, who are in charge of universities, edit the nation’s most important newspapers and magazines, and advise Democratic political candidates on their campaigns.

    So the fact that we are so widely off the mark in our perception of how most people feel about political correctness should probably also make us rethink some of our other basic assumptions about the country.

    It is obvious that certain elements on the right mock instances in which political correctness goes awry in order to win the license to spew outright racial hatred. And it is understandable that, in the eyes of some progressives, this makes anybody who dares to criticize political correctness a witting tool of—or a useful idiot for—the right. But that’s not fair to the Americans who feel deeply alienated by woke culture. Indeed, while 80 percent of Americans believe that political correctness has become a problem in the country, even more, 82 percent, believe that hate speech is also a problem.

    It turns out that while progressive activists tend to think that only hate speech is a problem, and devoted conservatives tend to think that only political correctness is a problem, a clear majority of all Americans holds a more nuanced point of view: They abhor racism. But they don’t think that the way we now practice political correctness represents a promising way to overcome racial injustice.

    The study should also make progressives more self-critical about the way in which speech norms serve as a marker of social distinction. I don’t doubt the sincerity of the affluent and highly educated people who call others out if they use “problematic” terms or perpetrate an act of “cultural appropriation.” But what the vast majority of Americans seem to see—at least according to the research conducted for “Hidden Tribes”—is not so much genuine concern for social justice as the preening display of cultural superiority.

    For the millions upon millions of Americans of all ages and all races who do not follow politics with rapt attention, and who are much more worried about paying their rent than about debating the prom dress worn by a teenager in Utah, contemporary callout culture merely looks like an excuse to mock the values or ignorance of others. As one 57- year-old woman in Mississippi fretted:

    The way you have to term everything just right. And if you don’t term it right you discriminate them. It’s like everybody is going to be in the know of what people call themselves now and some of us just don’t know. But if you don’t know then there is something seriously wrong with you.

    The gap between the progressive perception and the reality of public views on this issue could do damage to the institutions that the woke elite collectively run. A publication whose editors think they represent the views of a majority of Americans when they actually speak to a small minority of the country may eventually see its influence wane and its readership decline. And a political candidate who believes she is speaking for half of the population when she is actually voicing the opinions of one-fifth is likely to lose the next election.

    In a democracy, it is difficult to win fellow citizens over to your own side, or to build public support to remedy injustices that remain all too real, when you fundamentally misunderstand how they see the world.

    https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/ar...ctness/572581/
    Last edited by 26 Inf; 10-10-18 at 22:41.
    Patriotism means to stand by the country. It does not mean to stand by the President... - Theodore Roosevelt, Lincoln and Free Speech, Metropolitan Magazine, Volume 47, Number 6, May 1918.

    Every Communist must grasp the truth. Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun. Our principle is that the Party commands the gun, and the gun must never be allowed to command the Party Mao Zedong, 6 November, 1938 - speech to the Communist Patry of China's sixth Central Committee

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    I think whenever possible, every person should spend two years learning to cook.

    The skill means I spend time with Japanese, Chinese, Italian, Mexican and minority groups in the US. If we can agree on smoked BBQ ribs and fried chicken, we are coming from the same place and can figure out all the other stuff. When I'm eating great sushi, they aren't "those bastards who bombed Pearl Harbor", they were those guys who make amazing Miso soup.

    Italians? Hell I'll tolerate some level of organized crime if it means amazing pizza, manicotti to die for and wedding soup. Cubans? Do they have paella? We hell sit down and lets eat.

    I may not always agree with the politics of the guy throwing the pizza, but so long as neither of us is a rabid radical with extremist views I don't care who he votes for. We can discuss it over pizza and cappuccino if they wish.

    Hell I even used to buy amazing NJ style subs from a place where the girls were wearing Hillary for President t shirts. I knew who they were voting for, I knew some of their political views, but didn't matter because those subs were amazing.

    But we were talking. I'd consider their points and may or may not agree with them, and they'd listen to me and may or may not agree with my points.

    Since elections are usually a sham anyway, I think they should be giant food festivals where we meet the other side and eat really good food.
    It's hard to be a ACLU hating, philosophically Libertarian, socially liberal, fiscally conservative, scientifically grounded, agnostic, porn admiring gun owner who believes in self determination.

    Chuck, we miss ya man.

    كافر

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    This is now the majority of average people go through their day. It is amazing that our purported "leaders" on both sides don't listen to people or have any sense of what's important to most us until Harvard does a study and tells them what's what.
    Open the pig!

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    Quote Originally Posted by SteyrAUG View Post
    Since elections are usually a sham anyway, I think they should be giant food festivals where we meet the other side and eat really good food.
    Unless they are socialists, they have to stand in the bread line and not eat.

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    If we can ever root the lefty loons out of the MSM and the educational system, I think we will be 75% of the way toward this country being healed.

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    “25 percent of Americans are traditional or devoted conservatives, and their views are far outside the American mainstream.

    Some 8 percent of Americans are progressive activists, and their views are even less typical.

    By contrast, the two-thirds of Americans who don’t belong to either extreme constitute an “exhausted majority.”


    Note that traditional liberals are lumped in with the middle to define the mainstream majority while traditional conservatives are bundled with the further right and “far outside the American mainstream”. Not surprising coming from The Atlantic where a living constitution is the norm and originalism the philosophy of fuds.
    Last edited by uffdaphil; 10-11-18 at 11:26.
    “ When I comes to modern politics, I think the inverse of Hanlon's Razor applies...In other words, "Never attribute to stupidity that which is adequately explained by malice." - Kerplode

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    Quote Originally Posted by SteyrAUG View Post
    I think whenever possible, every person should spend two years learning to cook.

    The skill means I spend time with Japanese, Chinese, Italian, Mexican and minority groups in the US. If we can agree on smoked BBQ ribs and fried chicken, we are coming from the same place and can figure out all the other stuff. When I'm eating great sushi, they aren't "those bastards who bombed Pearl Harbor", they were those guys who make amazing Miso soup.

    Italians? Hell I'll tolerate some level of organized crime if it means amazing pizza, manicotti to die for and wedding soup. Cubans? Do they have paella? We hell sit down and lets eat.

    I may not always agree with the politics of the guy throwing the pizza, but so long as neither of us is a rabid radical with extremist views I don't care who he votes for. We can discuss it over pizza and cappuccino if they wish.

    Hell I even used to buy amazing NJ style subs from a place where the girls were wearing Hillary for President t shirts. I knew who they were voting for, I knew some of their political views, but didn't matter because those subs were amazing.

    But we were talking. I'd consider their points and may or may not agree with them, and they'd listen to me and may or may not agree with my points.

    Since elections are usually a sham anyway, I think they should be giant food festivals where we meet the other side and eat really good food.
    I almost always enjoy your take on things, this being a case in point.
    Patriotism means to stand by the country. It does not mean to stand by the President... - Theodore Roosevelt, Lincoln and Free Speech, Metropolitan Magazine, Volume 47, Number 6, May 1918.

    Every Communist must grasp the truth. Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun. Our principle is that the Party commands the gun, and the gun must never be allowed to command the Party Mao Zedong, 6 November, 1938 - speech to the Communist Patry of China's sixth Central Committee

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    Quote Originally Posted by TommyG View Post
    This is now the majority of average people go through their day. It is amazing that our purported "leaders" on both sides don't listen to people or have any sense of what's important to most us until Harvard does a study and tells them what's what.
    I try to interact with people though out the day, most often it is a 'hello, how are you?' and then 'good to hear, I'm fine thanks' but if I get a chance I engage folks in conversation. What amazes me is that despite having their noses buried in a phone most of the day, most folks don't have a clue as to what is going on nationally or locally.

    It seems to me we often think all folks are as concerned as we are about the agenda of the tribe they roll with. There are actually a helluva lot more bench riders than players, but they have opinions if asked.
    Patriotism means to stand by the country. It does not mean to stand by the President... - Theodore Roosevelt, Lincoln and Free Speech, Metropolitan Magazine, Volume 47, Number 6, May 1918.

    Every Communist must grasp the truth. Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun. Our principle is that the Party commands the gun, and the gun must never be allowed to command the Party Mao Zedong, 6 November, 1938 - speech to the Communist Patry of China's sixth Central Committee

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    Quote Originally Posted by uffdaphil View Post
    Note that traditional liberals are lumped in with the middle to define the mainstream majority while traditional conservatives are bundled with the further right and “far outside the American mainstream”. Not surprising coming from The Atlantic where a living constitution is the norm and originalism the philosophy of fuds.
    As I noted, the author of the article, and no doubt, the authors of the study, have a leftward slant. I think that as long as they don't skew data that matters little.

    As far as your statement while traditional conservatives are bundled with the further right I agree this is a valid complaint.

    But in terms of 'the middle' 66 to 75 percent, I think they are accurate in their portrayal of 'exhausted.' The far left and far right minorities tend to make all issues divisive.

    For example, there is a very vocal minority that believes a woman should be able to have an abortion, at her whim, into the third trimester. Likewise there is a very vocal minority that believe life starts at conception, and abortions should be against the law except for medical emergencies and rape.

    The vast majority of Americans, both Republican and Democrat, swim somewhere in the middle of those extremes. These are the folks that are willing to compromise and move to the middle of the issue in the hopes of getting something meaningful accomplished, instead they are given all or none choices, and nothing gets done.

    Pick almost any divisive issue of the day and I believe this is what you will find.
    Patriotism means to stand by the country. It does not mean to stand by the President... - Theodore Roosevelt, Lincoln and Free Speech, Metropolitan Magazine, Volume 47, Number 6, May 1918.

    Every Communist must grasp the truth. Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun. Our principle is that the Party commands the gun, and the gun must never be allowed to command the Party Mao Zedong, 6 November, 1938 - speech to the Communist Patry of China's sixth Central Committee

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    This article was written by a leftist who is attempting to define the debate their way.


    "If you look at what Americans have to say on issues such as immigration, the extent of white privilege, and the prevalence of sexual harassment, the authors argue"

    Those are not the issues people on the right care about or even think about.

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