Handgun or pistol defense against bear attacks

[flenna]

I remember reading about a hunting guide who stopped a bear attack with a S&W 3913 (9mm) with hard cast bullets, I think Buffalo Bore. This was recently, probably only a year or two ago.

[eric0311]

I actually had to shoot a bear in the 90s that came at me. I was in the hills and laughed it off when I was told to keep that old Blackhawk holstered on my hip.

So yeah..... You need a .44. Some smart ass will come up with some lies about downing a bear with a 9mm or a .40 and bill drilling them.

NO.

When some big ass, hairy, snarling beast stands up and sounds like a pissed off wookie and is coming at you... You want that .44.

There are numerous documented cases of 9mm being used in Bear (brown and black) attacks…

[Pappabear]

There are numerous documented cases of 9mm being used in Bear (brown and black) attacks…

And what happened ? I need to look into some of these bullets. Can someone point me to best bullets for my 9mm HK P30 for hairy critters. In reality, AZ doesn't have big bears but our wolf problem is growing and will suck in future years.

PB

[HKGuns]

And what happened ?
PB

They were eaten.

Lots of people survive being shot by 9mm. Taking it for bear defense is darn near stupid.

Haven't thought much about wolf defense. Not sure you'd need the penetration of Hard Cast lead on a wolf. I bet your buddy Markm could cook you up some spicy 9mm loads.

[eric0311]

They were eaten.

Lots of people survive being shot by 9mm. Taking it for bear defense is darn near stupid.

Haven't thought much about wolf defense. Not sure you'd need the penetration of Hard Cast lead on a wolf. I bet your buddy Markm could cook you up some spicy 9mm loads.

Google is your friend, gents... try it.

https://sportingclassicsdaily.com/de...ts-by-caliber/

For the less-technologically inclined folks.... I'll summarize the (4) known (to this articles author) uses of 9mm on Bears:

1. Alaska, Russian River, Grizzly Charged Fishermen, 9mm 17 August, 2002

But then the bear turned, looked up at Brenner and lunged, said Lewis, who interviewed the three men Saturday.

Brenner fired twice at the center of the hulking shape closing to four or five feet away. The sow, estimated at 400 to 450 pounds, went down. Brenner then put three more bullets into her head.

He used a 9 mm semiautomatic pistol. Lewis said such a low-caliber gun ordinarily doesn’t pack enough punch to kill a bear. But Brenner loaded the pistol with full-metal-jacket bullets that penetrated to the bear’s vital organs, he said.

2. Bear Charged John Tiebohl, 9 mm, 31 August, 2004 Bachelor Gulch, Colorado

BACHELOR GULCH – The Aug. 31 shooting of a bear in Bachelor Gulch still echoes among residents in the upscale enclave.The Colorado Division of Wildlife continues to investigate the incident, in which homeowner John Tietbohl shot and wounded a bear outside his Daybreak Ridge home. Tietbohl told officers the bear had been trying to get into his home, then charged him as he was getting into his car that evening. Tietbohl, who had been carrying a 9-millimeter pistol as a sidearm to protect himself from the bear, shot and hit the animal, which left a trail of blood as it ran off.Earlier in the day, Bachelor Gulch security officers had repeatedly sprayed pepper spray at the bear near Tietbohl’s house, but the animal stayed around. The bear also reportedly slipped into Tietbohl’s garage in the days before it was shot.

3. AK: Guide Kills Attacking Grizzly with 9mm, July, 2016

In the last week in July, 2016, Phil Shoemaker had use a 9mm pistol to kill a grizzly that was threatening his clients and himself. It worked. (this is the well documented case in which the guide used 147 grain +P hardcast Buffalo Bore)

4. Bowhunters, Spray Failed, 9mm, Grizzly October, 2017, account from two sources, Todd Orr, and Eye-witness, Beaver Creek, MT.


I interviewed both sources. The attack was reported to Fish and Game, but was not published.

It was at the end of the day, and was getting dark. Two bow hunters, were returning from their bow hunt. They both had bear spray and pistols. They had agreed that if forced into defending themselves, one would use spray, the other would back up the spray with his pistol.

The male grizzly bluff charged several times, blocking their return to camp.

Warning shots were fired in the air with a 9 mm pistol. The bear ran off, then came back. Bear spray was utilized but only extended 10 feet into a light head wind and did not reach the bear. The bear would not disengage. It kept coming back and getting closer. The aggressive bear was finally shot with the 9 mm pistol at close range. It ran off. The report was made to Fish and Wildlife, and the bear was found dead the next day. Eye-witness believes it was one shot to the chest of the bear.

HKGuns... it appears as if your assertion that these folks who knowingly carried a 9mm (aptly loaded with the proper penetrating ammunition) were not, in fact, eaten.

[B Cart]

Google is your friend, gents... try it.

https://sportingclassicsdaily.com/de...ts-by-caliber/

For the less-technologically inclined folks.... I'll summarize the (4) known (to this articles author) uses of 9mm on Bears:

1. Alaska, Russian River, Grizzly Charged Fishermen, 9mm 17 August, 2002

But then the bear turned, looked up at Brenner and lunged, said Lewis, who interviewed the three men Saturday.

Brenner fired twice at the center of the hulking shape closing to four or five feet away. The sow, estimated at 400 to 450 pounds, went down. Brenner then put three more bullets into her head.

He used a 9 mm semiautomatic pistol. Lewis said such a low-caliber gun ordinarily doesn’t pack enough punch to kill a bear. But Brenner loaded the pistol with full-metal-jacket bullets that penetrated to the bear’s vital organs, he said.

2. Bear Charged John Tiebohl, 9 mm, 31 August, 2004 Bachelor Gulch, Colorado

BACHELOR GULCH – The Aug. 31 shooting of a bear in Bachelor Gulch still echoes among residents in the upscale enclave.The Colorado Division of Wildlife continues to investigate the incident, in which homeowner John Tietbohl shot and wounded a bear outside his Daybreak Ridge home. Tietbohl told officers the bear had been trying to get into his home, then charged him as he was getting into his car that evening. Tietbohl, who had been carrying a 9-millimeter pistol as a sidearm to protect himself from the bear, shot and hit the animal, which left a trail of blood as it ran off.Earlier in the day, Bachelor Gulch security officers had repeatedly sprayed pepper spray at the bear near Tietbohl’s house, but the animal stayed around. The bear also reportedly slipped into Tietbohl’s garage in the days before it was shot.

3. AK: Guide Kills Attacking Grizzly with 9mm, July, 2016

In the last week in July, 2016, Phil Shoemaker had use a 9mm pistol to kill a grizzly that was threatening his clients and himself. It worked. (this is the well documented case in which the guide used 147 grain +P hardcast Buffalo Bore)

4. Bowhunters, Spray Failed, 9mm, Grizzly October, 2017, account from two sources, Todd Orr, and Eye-witness, Beaver Creek, MT.


I interviewed both sources. The attack was reported to Fish and Game, but was not published.

It was at the end of the day, and was getting dark. Two bow hunters, were returning from their bow hunt. They both had bear spray and pistols. They had agreed that if forced into defending themselves, one would use spray, the other would back up the spray with his pistol.

The male grizzly bluff charged several times, blocking their return to camp.

Warning shots were fired in the air with a 9 mm pistol. The bear ran off, then came back. Bear spray was utilized but only extended 10 feet into a light head wind and did not reach the bear. The bear would not disengage. It kept coming back and getting closer. The aggressive bear was finally shot with the 9 mm pistol at close range. It ran off. The report was made to Fish and Wildlife, and the bear was found dead the next day. Eye-witness believes it was one shot to the chest of the bear.

HKGuns... it appears as if your assertion that these folks who knowingly carried a 9mm (aptly loaded with the proper penetrating ammunition) were not, in fact, eaten.

As another example, anyone remember this youtube video of a snowmobiler shooting a charging moose with a 9mm? He gave the moose a warning shot and then dumped a few into it, promptly taking it down. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0h1XlsskYmY

I have some 147gr hardcast solids for my 9mm, but rarely carry it, as i always have my 10mm with 200gr hardcast solids when in the woods.

[eric0311]

No doubt…The penetration on 9mm hardcast is pretty amazing.

[Disciple]

No doubt…The penetration on 9mm hardcast is pretty amazing.

It doesn't look amazing here. Clear Gel isn't ideal but I don't think it invalidates the relative comparison.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LXF5HOQz5WY&t=425s

[eric0311]

It doesn't look amazing here. Clear Gel isn't ideal but I don't think it invalidates the relative comparison.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LXF5HOQz5WY&t=425s

You’re right… clear gel testing might not spell the entire performance package of 9mm hardcast ammo. All we can really lean heavily on is real world engagements on actual living tissue (see above posted article highlighting 4 known/documented uses)

[HKGuns]

Well, you win the internet for today. Congratulations!

I'll continue carrying 44 Mag when in bear country. You are free to carry 9mm, I don't care enough to argue about it on the internet.

Its not like it hasn't already been done thousands of times before in gun forums all over the internet.